The Immigration Bill

Sunday, May 20, 2007
I have a number of relatives and friends back home in the UK who've always dreamed of emigrating to the USA.

Am I right in thinking that now is the right time for them to come over for an extended (nudge-nudge, wink-wink) 'vacation' ?

Just askin.


Buddy Larsen said...

Tell 'em to leave Lord Cornwallis at home this time, okay?

Luther McLeod said...

I'd say tell them to follow their dreams. Though I hate to see the UK lose even more good folk.

Buddy Larsen said...

I agree. There is hardly anything more valuable to the USA than native English-speakers over here telling us is our native language why they left a more nanny state for a lesser one. Stuart Varney comes immediately to mind, but there are many others (including ex-dem, right here).

terrye said...

Is now the time? Well as long as they don't speak Spanish. Although antiforeigner sentiment is running high.

richard mcenroe said...

Not if they're employable or liable to vote Republican. Can't have that...

Doug said...

So Far, this is still my favorite Newsbyte on Immigration:
Kennedy's Bill had them paying back taxes, Bush insisted on taking that out, as it would be too hard to figure.
No problem figuring credit for Social Security Bennies:
Why Doesn't This Surprise Me - Mark Krikorian
"Bush removes provision requiring back taxes from illegal immigrants"

Doug said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
bobalharb said...

22 Reasons to Hound Your Congressmen

Doug said...

Robert Rector on Immigration 15 min wma stream.
Illegals cost 30k in Govt Services, Pay 10k in taxes.
...and cause far more murder and mayhem per capita than natives.

Doug said...

Rep. Brian Bilbray, R-Calif., who heads the House immigration reform caucus, said ``the worst thing you can do if you try to control illegal immigration is reward 12 to 20 million illegal aliens with citizenship and permanent residency.''

Yet he added, ``I think it passes if big business is able to basically put the pressure on and say, `We give you Republicans a lot of money. We want you to deliver us a cheap vote.'''
Mitch McConnell

The Whole F-ing Story? [Kathryn Jean Lopez]
Powerline has more has more on the McCain-Cornyn incident.

As the clock moved closer to 1:30 p.m., Senator McCain suddenly lost it. "This is chickenshit," he told Senator Cornyn. "I think it would expedite things if you would just leave the room, Senator, so we can get along with finishing this up." Senator Cornyn responded: "Wait a minute. We’ve been meeting for three months on this in good faith, and now you parachute in here this morning and tell me to leave? I think you’re out of line."

Senator McCain responded: "F*** you! I know what is going on here.

I know more about immigration than anybody in this room!”

Other Senators moved in to calm things down, and the talks went on. Senator Cornyn’s provision was not included. At 1:30 p.m. sharp, the conferees (not including Senators Cornyn or Menendez and a few other negotiators) were in the press gallery, congratulating each other. Senator Kennedy recognized Senator McCain early to make his televised comments, then Senator McCain departed before the press conference was over for a flight to New York City. Later that afternoon, he missed yet another Senate vote -– this one on the Democrats' $2.9 trillion budget plan, an outline for the largest tax increase in U.S. history.

Doug said...

Great link, Bobal.
While we're giving them Z Visas, why don't we give them free Z VISA Cards?

Doug said...

Citizen Revolt Building

Emergency Senate Fax Campaign To Stop Amnesty
Tell The Senate: “No Amnesty for Illegals!”

Senate leadership is racing to pass an amnesty bill before Memorial Day—and they aren’t interested in hearing the opinions of grassroots Americans! Only a massive grassroots initiative can short-circuit the Harry Reid, Ted Kennedy and George Bush open borders push.

Citizen Revolt Building
Already 792,000 faxes and petitions have been sent to leadership opposing amnesty for illegals -- over 100,000 faxes scheduled since the Senate announcement! Join with Grassfire today in sending a strong “Secure our Border and NO Amnesty for Illegals” message to the Senate by scheduling your faxes!
Grassfire Homepage

chuck said...

12 to 20 million illegal aliens with citizenship and permanent residency.

So what are you gonna do, Doug. Deport them? Where? Or maybe put them on barges and drown them? The solution has to start somewhere and we would have been better off if it started twenty years ago. Let's not wait another twenty.

Some of you guys are starting to sound downright Stalinesque, hunting down and moving whole populations and peoples. Heck, the Japanese internment in WWII involved only 110,000, dealing with 12 to 20 million is a whole two orders of magnitude greater.

As far as I can see, the major problem with the bill is that no one trusts the government to carry out its provisions, i.e., build the fence before anything else kicks in. The other problem is that the furshlinger thing is 400-800 pages long, and apart from comprehending the contents, there's a chance plenty of loop holes have been inserted.

Anyway, I was one of those ready to believe the worst of the bill, but it really doesn't look that bad to me now that I am beginning to get some feel for it.

Doug said...

I like that:
Attribute actions to me that I have not advocated, then curse me for such advocacy!

Doug said...

Viva Business! Viva La Raza!

Business executives have been working closely with Hispanic groups, like the National Council of La Raza, in seeking a comprehensive immigration bill.
These alliances were on display last week at a dinner celebrating the 25th anniversary of the National Immigration Forum, a pro-immigrant advocacy group.

bobalharb said...

Build a fence and deport them. Save our society.

bobalharb said...

Take some advice from the Mexicans. Do as they do on their southern border.

chuck said...

Attribute actions to me that I have not advocated, then curse me for such advocacy!

So what *do* you advocate? What is your solution? You haven't said.

Doug said...

Bush is just about to get warmed up on that Fence:
It's only been 5 years since 9-11.
And now they are promising half as much fence as was mandated for in legislation passed year.
That's Progress!

Duncan Hunter got the San Diego fence built when Clinton was President.
Over 90% effective, crime has plummeted there.

AZ Gov claims in one breath that fences don't work, in the next she is saying Illegals have skyrocketed in Az because of the San Diego Fence.

Doug said...

I advocate starving the Ukrainians.

If we can't do that, let's pass that Amnesty Bill!

Gotta do SOMETHING to give MORE benefits to Democrat Voters and Businesses in League with La Raza.

Doug said...

Had Bush attained Bill Clinton levels of Workplace Enforcement (AFTER 9-11) the flood would have been reduced.
Likewise for Border Security, but he had no interest until forced, and now his favorite Prosecutor, Mr. Sutton puts agents in Jail, and rewards currently active Drug Smugglers!
So I would advocate doing the opposite of what GWB has done.
Enforce the Law.

Doug said...

sam said...
"Meanwhile, the reluctance of Washington to be seen to enforce its own borders is very perplexing.

From the "Washington sniper" to 9/11, there has been for a generation a clear nationalsecurity component to the illegal immigration issue.

To present it only as a matter of "the jobs Americans won't do" is lazily reductive. The economists may see the vast human tide as an army of much-needed hotel maids and farm workers and nurses and plumbers, but to assume that everyone on the planet sees themselves as primarily an economic entity is complacent and (post-September 11th) obtusely deluded.

The political class' urge to capitulate on the integrity of the national border sends as important a message to the world about American will as their urge to capitulate on Iraq.

America, Z Beautiful

Cutler said...

"So what are you gonna do, Doug. Deport them? Where? Or maybe put them on barges and drown them? The solution has to start somewhere and we would have been better off if it started twenty years ago. Let's not wait another twenty."

The solution is targeting employers with fines, refusing social services, and enforcing current law. They'll leave on their own.

In other words, it is so obvious that it can't even be acknowledged, lest people realize they don't have only 2 bad choices.

Cutler said...

Listen to the mentioned Robert Rector clip for why you would want to do it, financially and politically. That is, if enforcing American law isn't a good enough reason to start with.

bobalharb said...

Don't let the employers get away with tax deductions for the illegal labor would help.

chuck said...

The solution is targeting employers with fines, refusing social services, and enforcing current law. They'll leave on their own.

Do you think illegals would be better off under those circumstances if they went elsewhere? I'm not convinced. And what about children born in the US who are US citizens? What about the cash economies in the cities like New York, cash economies that have been around forever and never pay taxes? You may discomfit a few companies at the high end by enforcement, but I suspect a black market in labor will develop. Economies are like that: drug sales, prostitution, gambling, all continue quite nicely even when they are illegal and serve to make criminals rich. I think massive enforcement would be required, and would be resisted by the cities and many other people. Overall, it would be a waste of money and time better spent elsewhere.

Look, I don't think the bill is perfect, far from it. It is too long at 326 pages, and much too complicated. I don't think it needs to be like that, but it is a starting point. Lord knows enough other pending disasters are being ignored, social security and other entitlements come to mind. Let's see if we can at least make a start at dealing with illegal immigration. I'm with Hugh that it needs a lot of debate. I'm with Captain Ed that it is a start.

Doug said...

"It is too long at 326 pages, and much too complicated.
I don't think it needs to be like that, but it is a starting point. Lord knows enough other pending disasters are being ignored, social security and other entitlements come to mind.
Let's see if we can at least make a start at dealing with illegal immigration.

"The solution has to start somewhere and we would have been better off if it started twenty years ago. Let's not wait another twenty."

Ted Kennedy on Immigration [Mark Krikorian]

1965: "The bill will not flood our cities with immigrants. It will not upset the ethnic mix of our society. It will not relax the standards of admission. It will not cause American workers to lose their jobs."

1986: "This amnesty will give citizenship to only 1.1 to 1.3 million illegal aliens. We will secure the borders henceforth. We will never again bring forward another amnesty bill like this."

2007: "Now it is time for action. 2007 is the year we must fix our broken system."

Doug said...

Read My Flips
GWB on Back Taxes.
Mickey Kaus

No Back Taxes! ... If You're an Illegal Immigrant.

President Bush in an address from the Oval Office a year ago:

I believe that illegal immigrants who have roots in our country and want to stay should have to pay a meaningful penalty for breaking the law, to pay their taxes, to learn English, and to work in a job for a number of years.
People who meet these conditions should be able to apply for citizenship ... [E.A.]
Forget that part about the taxes.

The Bush administration actually asked that the provision requiring payment of back taxes be dropped from the bill, and it was taken out.
Kennedy had it in! ...

Try that "difficult and time consuming" excuse out on the IRS if you're a U.S. citizen and see how far it gets you.

Doug said...

With Liberty and Amnesty for All

OK, show of hands here please of those who believe the Bush, Boehner, McConnell gang will ever oblige any Mexican citizen, under any circumstance, to return home.

The current proposed bill doesn’t provide for the bureaucratic infrastructure to accomplish this.
We can’t keep track of people here on tourist and student visas now.

How on earth are we supposed to run a system that would fine, tax, and do background checks on millions of Mexicans (and others) here illegally while at the same time keeping track of where they are? To the nearest hundred thousand, how many more federal bureaucrats would this require if we were even serious about doing it?

On this one, W once again finds himself aligned with elites rather than with a clear majority of Americans who want the invasion stopped and then reversed. His constituencies on this scam are: big business (motto: mucho trabajo -- poco dinero), Democrats and other liberals/leftists, Hispanics (especially of the registered voter kind), reconquistadores, academe, and the Mexican government.

W is not only dead wrong on the issue, he has of late been adding insult to injury by suggesting that those who oppose his we-don-need-no-stinking-borders policy are a bunch a racist yahoos and xenophobes. This attitude on the part of W and other no-borders advocates can only be accounted for by arrogance and political tone-deafness of operatic dimensions.

ex-democrat said...

as an immigrant myself, i have to say i'm with doug/thornberry on this one.
i was also struck by this comment: "The political class' urge to capitulate on the integrity of the national border sends as important a message to the world about American will as their urge to capitulate on Iraq."

ex-democrat said...

I'd also give citizenship to any foreigner that can prove they've made pro-american statements - while in the company of other foreigners - during the past four years.

Washington_insider said...

We don't need no stinking immigration...

Whip_it_Whip_it_good said...

Down in Lou'siana, where the alligators grow so mean,
There lived a girl that I swear to the world,
Made the alligators look tame,
Poke Salad [Bb]Annie, Poke Salad Annie
Everybody said it was a shame, cause her
Mama was a workin on the chain gang
(a mean, vicious woman)

terrye said...

I am completely disgusted with the right on this. The other day I saw some link where some guy was talking about McCain giving head to HoChiMinh. The man spends years in a POW camp and is treated like this by some troll on a rightie blog with all these folks just yukking it up. I saw someone else call Hispanics brown dwarfs who stink like refried beans. And Bush is in a conspiracy to turn the Southwest over to Mexico. What a load of crap. It seems the right has almost as many loons as the left anymore.

This is a compromise bill, it requires compromise. The Republicans do not have the majority and I think a lot of them have forgotten how to count. They can not just go in there and say we get everything we want and you guys get diddly. Why would the Democrats go for that? Have we forgotten what it means to negotiate, to compromise, to give up something for the greater good? To remember that not everyone will agree with us and that just because they don't that does not mean they should be demonized or that they want to hurt America.

If the hardliners kill the bill, they lose the enforcment enhancements and they are still not going to deport all these people. It took years for us to get to this point, it is not possible to round them all up and ship them out. So what is gained?

They are staying and they go to the back of the line. Kill this bill and the Democrats end up where they started, but the Republicans will lose and they do not have the numbers to over ride. That is just a political reality.

I think some folks have lost their minds on this issue. I don't remember a time when that border was not open and no one, not the states or cities or counties or anyone made a priority of dealing with this problem. So why blame the Feds? When you drive the down the road and see those people in the fields, do you call INS, do you want their jobs? No...the American people have allowed this to happen and now we need to deal with that and that requires compromise. Like it or not. That is just a political reality. Everything else is hate mongering rabble rousing noise.

terrye said...

And as for the McCain incident, who cares? How petty is that? I remember when Cheney told Leahy to go eff himself and people thought it was funny. But this is McCain who did not want to make it law to shoot a wetback everyday and so he must be punished.

What a bunch of pussies. Making a big deal out of this when McCain has been insulted time and again by people who do not have any qualms at all about the stuff they say.

terrye said...

And when it comes to Ted Kennedy I would not vote for the man if you put a gun to my head but thanks to the fact the hysterical right helped the Republicans lose the last election Kennedy is someone they have to deal with. Them is the rules. The guys who win get to decide what bills come up etc. etc.

So if Kennedy wants to stop a vote he can. I think there are some pundits and bloggers and talk show hosts who fail to understand that. The Republicans can not waltz in there with a bill requiring the deportation of 10 million people and 1400 mile fence with a moat around it and a hot wire on top as well as a prison sentence for anyone who knowingly had their hair done by a beautician from south of the border. It does not work that way.

Habu said...


Well let's see.
Can't round 'em all up....why not?

Betcha we could..might take some time but we could do it.

Are you old enough to remember the Merilitos?

If you are then you recall what a huge impact they made on Miami..totally tranformed the city.

Do you read Mark Steyn? Here's a sample of his take and then a link to his article...worth read'n..

Great news! Being illegal is now perfectly legal! Just for being one of the circa 12 million people who shouldn't be here, you can now be here indefinitely! If you were living and working in America illegally before Jan. 1, 2007, you're now entitled to one of the new Z-1 "probationary" visas. And your parents and spouses are entitled to one of the new Z-2 visas, and your children to the new Z-3 visas.

Don't worry: It's not an "amnesty." Every politician in America is opposed to amnesty -- if not the concept, then at least the word. That's why the visa starts with the letter that's furthest away from the one "amnesty" begins with. "Z" stands for zellout . . . no, hang on, zurrender or Zapatista, or some other word way up the other end of the alphabet from "amnesty." But the point is, at a stroke there will be no more illegal immigrants. Because being illegal means you're now legal.

Mark Steyn

terrye said...


Yes, I read Mark Steyn and I agree with a lot of what he says, but not all of it. And this is one of the times I don't agree.

And I will never support rounding all these people and putting them in cattle cars or something. I will not do it.

Think about this, if we managed to deport 10,000 a month, it would take a century to deport 12 million people.

We do have laws about that too you know and it is interesting to me that the same people who keep saying just enforce the laws as if were as simple as waving a magic wand, ignore the fact that we have laws when it comes to processing people for deportation. Those laws they want to ignore. Just round em up and ship em out.

Tell me, what do you think the reaction of the average American would be to seeing millions of people forceabley removed from their homes and hauled off somewhere? Think of Katrina times 1,000.

I have news for Mark Steyn, he is from Canada, a place where every one looks as if they should be named Doug or Brenda. The numbers of people we are talking about here are roughly half the population of Canada. And Canada has its own issues with immigration and who they welcome to their shores so perhaps he should worry about them for awhile. At least most of these people are Catholic, not jihadis.

I used to be a realtor and there is a little known law that allows people to claim squatters rights. The idea is that if people sit on some property for years and their use of that property is open and notorious then under certain circumstances they can lay claim to it. The idea being that possession is 9/10 of the law.

We have let these people come in for years. Most of them live in plain sight. We eat the food they pick and people live in the houses they helped build etc. And in all those years no effort was made to enforce those laws because the majority of people had no desire to bother with them.

And now when the numbers have reached a level when it would be insane to try and deport all these people....we hear people say enforce the law and round them up.

Not me. I won't have anything to do with that. Count me out, it makes as much sense as Prohibition.

terrye said...

BTW, the last poll I saw on the subject of mass deportation put the number opposed at about 8 out of 10.

Doug said...

Why do you always engage in hyperbole?
Most folks aren't calling for mass deportation, nor do they talk or write like the Prejudiced Honkies you reference above.
Nobody at NRO does, nor Hewitt, and etc, but they all disagree with you.

Can't you just accept that without casting false aspersion on so many?

Doug said...

Doesn't serve the discussion very well imo to accuse people of wanting to sink people on barges, and the like, for instance.

terrye said...


I was responding to habu who did talk about mass deportation. And by the way, if you don't deport them and you just sort of ignore them except to bitch about them, isn't that kind of a half ass amnesty?

You know I have been called enough names by the hardliner crowd in the last three days that I just don't feel all that charitable right now.

So, last years we went through something like this and so these guys said set out the election, teach them a lesson...and so the Democrats won and now they are all amazed and shocked and outraged that Kennedy is actually in charge of something. Are they just dense?

But they are not done yet. No siree.

I saw over at The Anchoress that she has received an email about a google bomb. Gonna get these bad Republicans who are not staying in line by Golly. Dig up some dirt. Great. This time when the paleos get done slapping Bush around and eating their own the Democrats will probably have a super majority in the Congress and the White House too.

Way to go.

terrye said...


And you know something else? In a democratic form of government there is such a thing as compromise, as negotiation and by its nature it requires that someone give something up. The problem with people like Hewitt is that they never want to give anything up and nothing will be just the way you want it to. It is a lot easier to pick apart something and wreck it and find fault with it and demand the impossible than it is to actually come up with a solution to a problem as polarizing and difficult as this one is.

And in the last few days I have lost a lot of respect for a lot of people. And I really don't care if that sounds unproductive to you. These people are doing their best to kill a bill and leave nothing productive in its wake...just because they do not understand that the Democrats will not just roll over for them.

O'Reilley is getting hate mail because he was not nasty enough about the bill and he is not exactly a communist.

No, do not lecture me. Considering the childish and shrill nonsense going on out there.

terrye said...

And what do you mean I always engage in hyberbole? This is the first time in weeks I have even been on here.

Maybe you should take my place doug.

Luther McLeod said...

I resent, dislike and don't appreciate having to press 'one' for English.

The further down this road we go the less there is to save. Until eventually we are a Babylonian mass with insufficient common thread to remain whole.

Nasty decisions need to be made. They will not be. Well enough to say that we will adjust and change, but the change will make us unrecognizable. Many will think that a good thing. I happen to not agree.

I am not a monster.

terrye said...

It has nothing to do with being a monster, it has to do with not having the votes.

It has to do with the ability to compromise. If there is no compromise here there will be employer sanction increases, no more border enhancements. etc. And you will still be punching that annoying Spanish butten. Believe it or not a law outlawing Spanish is not going to pass either.

Ho to hell with it. I am not a monster either and I wish the people who have called me traitor, liar, tool, wetback, moron would remember that.

I am disappointed in the right. Plain and simple.

ex-democrat said...

boy, terrye, that's an awful lot of venom aimed in the general direction of those on this thread who question the proposed immigration bill - typically because they believe that good fences are an essential prerequisite of national sovereignty.

but if i can brush past the cadres of straw men for a second, let me ask you this: what do you perceive to be the exigent circumstance here that requires some form of compromise be agreed to - even if it means no real border enforcement? to my way of thinking a bill that lacks genuine border enforcement is not one that is urgently needed. Am I wrong? If so, why?

bobalharb said...

Immigration Counters

Kind of makes your head ache.

Habu said...

Rick ole boy,

If Terrye is quite capable of defending herself what are you doing as her interloper?

As for screwing up threads you and I both know that conversations and points get carried from one thread to another all the time.

I can to this tread because I say it was associated with Buddy Larsen.
Now you are threating me with immediate censure if I don't comply with your demands. Are you the head cheese?

So, why don't you tell me exactly what tone you would like me to use. What tenses I can use and whether bold and italics are allowed. Also if you would please refer me to the "Flares in the Darkness" bloggers rulebook so that it doesn't appear as though you are simply acting in a pique of indignation I will be happy to read it. Or is this an ad hoc dictatorship averse to free expression.

I'm sure to my "head cheese " question you'll repond that you have full authority to heave-ho any contributor who crosses whatever line you happen to decide to draw that day.

So no, if you just direct me to the writers manual I'll begin my study of the "Flares into Darkness" rulebook.

Doug said...

Seems some, for quite some time now, would rather blame people who have been consistently right, like Duncan Hunter, Brian Bilbray, John Cornyn, Jeff Sessions, and the like, than the people most responsible for this mess:
Ted Kennedy, John McCain, and GWB.

The Border could have, and SHOULD have been secured immediately after 9-11.
Had that been done, we would be more secure, and with decent workplace enforcement we would now have about 5 million fewer illegals, much less gang crime and narcoterrorist drug smuggling, closed emergency rooms, murders and mayhem on the roadways and etc.

It was not done, so here we are, and some people are proposing we cave and go with Bush/Kennedy and give away the country just when momentum is mounting on the right to stop this like we stopped Harriet Miers.

I beseech you to check out Hugh Hewitt's site Terrye:
You will not find one bit of hatred or racism there from this immigration moderate and tireless Bush Booster, even for Harriet Miers!

Hugh took the time and effort this weekend to read the whole damned thing, 300 plus pages, and has now written over 10,000 words on it.

He is a respected Constitutional Lawyer who worked for Nixon and Reagan, among others.

We do not have to cave as you insist we do, and not all of us are cavemen, although as ex-dem points out, I guess there are Caveman Strawmen.

What is there that's just about letting illegals not pay taxes while giving them benefits paid for by honest, taxpaying CITIZENS?

What is JUST about making people with names like Mark, or Brenda, or Doug go through years of hoops while uneducated folks that don't even want to assimilate and learn the language are given a free pass, in state tuition, free medical care, foodstamps, and etc?

It is NOT just the Marks, Brendas, and Dougs that are made to pay in this way, Terrye!

We have a friend here from Kuala Lumpur who finally, after NINE YEARS, got his citizenship, after trying all that time while working up the corporate ladder.

He speaks perfect English, and knows more about American History than 98% of the illegals from South of the Border.

The stories go on and on in this gateway to Asia-Pacific, with established, successful Vietnamese, Chinese, and others given the run around in their pursuit of citizenship.

The INS is a corrupt organization! We cannot entrust them for the 4th time to carry out a plan to save the country!

Doug said...

You are disappointed with the right, Terrye, I am angered by those who from the get-go five years ago have been leveling false charges and all manner of emotional language at those who are trying to maintain the rule of law, our economy in the long term, and our services and security.

GWB was quick to throw around the word "Vigilante" some years ago, with virtually no evidence of this being a significant problem.

Words like exclusionist, racist, xenophobe, etc etc rapidly followed from him and his supporters.

Not very honorable in my opinion, not very helpful in solving the problem, and most of all not very honest.

Limbaugh was a little late to the table compared to some of us like VDH and lots of other Calif natives that lived the future many years ago there wrt immigration, but he has come around, and is a master at distilling things down.

Like this:
"If it is really true that what this country needs to remain strong and prosperous is ever-larger numbers of unskilled, poorly educated, low wage workers, then Mexico must be doing exceptionally well, cause they have plenty of them!"

Doug said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Doug said...

It took Rush a while to come around, because he no longer lived in Calif. was not raised there, and grew up at the feet of his great father and grandfather, who came of age in a different World.

His grandfather, a lawyer who still worked at age 100, always chuckled about perceived problems with immigration, because he thought he had seen it all before with the prejudice in the early 1900's against Southern European Immigrants, and etc, fears that did not prove out over time.

Rush finally learned what many Californians have observed for years:

Things are different now in basic and vital ways,
starting with our schools, social welfare system, Popular Culture ("multiculturalism" PC, and anti American, Anti-Heroic, Pop Celebrity figures) Justice System, increased automation, and finally, the immigrants themselves, many of whom have no intention or desire to assimilate as the Southern Europeans did eventually in the past when there was no welfare, schools taught patriotism and provided good educations for all, and many Hollywood Idols were superpatriots like Jimmy Stewart.

Worse, there are groups like La Raza, who for the last 40 years have been spreading their evil message and calls for changes that none of us will benefit from in the the long run.

Mayor Villagarosa of Los Angeles is a nominal American who was active in some equally vile organization in the past, and feels no need to try and maintain the cultural institutions responsible for the vast differences in freedom and opportunity between the USA and Mexico.

A question, Terrye:
If I found that my cause could benefit from allying myself with David Duke, would you have no criticism for my doing so?

Why then, is it not objectionable to you to support the business people's positions that they reach in consort with groups such as La Razza and the like?

The Reconquista movement is alive and well in Southern California and elsewhere!

This is no time to capitulate.

Doug said...

The new immigration bill being pimped on us by the Bush-Kennedy Klan is a lot like Barbra Streisand and Cher.

Debbie Schlussel


John Fund told an amazing tale:
Compared to our population, the illegals crossing the borders problem was worse in 1950 than it is now:
Ike sent one of his Generals from Europe down with orders to secure the border, and warn businesses that they would be outed and shamed if they cheated, and put out of business if they didn't stop.
Then he upped the Braccero program to 500k a year coming up to do seasonal work.
In a couple of years, illegals went from over half a million a year to 50,000!

Then, when LBJ got elected, the Unions, and our hero Cezar Chavez got him to do away with the Bracero program.

That, and 3 fixes from DC Ted and Co brings us to today.
"The railroad Bracero program ended promptly with the conclusion of World War II, in 1945, but the agricultural program under various forms survived until 1964, when the two governments ended it as a response to harsh criticisms and reports of human rights abuses. The program made a large contribution to U.S. agriculture, leading to the advent of mechanized farming. However the program, for the most part from a humanitarian standpoint, was deemed a complete and utter failure.[citation needed]

The workers who participated in the Bracero Program have generated significant local and international struggles challenging the US government and Mexican government to identify and return deductions taken from their pay, from 1942 to 1948, for savings accounts which they were legally guaranteed to receive upon their return to Mexico at the conclusion of their contracts. Many, if not most, never received their savings. However, lawsuits presented in federal courts in California, in the late 1990s and early 2000s, highlighted the substandard conditions and documented the ultimate destiny of the savings accounts deductions, but the suit was thrown out because the Mexican banks in question never operated in the United States."
The Bracero communities of my youth were far better than many today living in the hills of California:

They were provided food and housing on the farms;
A little policing to avoid exploitation, and the problem would be solved.

The guy that became owner of the San Diego Chargers got his start catering lunch for the campesinos!
I was discussing immigration with a Christian Eritrean coworker today who is here legally, who said something that everyone should take note of. He said it is so difficult for Africans to get legal visas that many of them are now going first to Latin America and crossing the Mexican border because they know there is no enforcement.
- The Bruno
El Presidente Jorge Arbusto sings praises of some of great heros of our time:
Cesar Chavez, Che, Hugo...

Doug said...

One day, despite the plastic surgery, Barbra Streisand and Cher will truly retire and/or die. And their tours will end.

Unfortunately, "comprehensive immigration reform" will not. It can and will go through infinite make-overs and plastic surgery operations from new generations of Congress.

This version won't be the last one.

Yup, unfortunately, while the two loudmouthed, chintzy singers from the '70s will someday actually end their tours of America, immigration amnesty is a bad concert tour that will plague America forever . . . or until there is no America left.

It used to be only two things were for certain: death and taxes. Now, it's death, taxes, and "comprehensive immigration reform" a/k/a illegal alien amnesty.

Chertoff confirms after being questioned at least 6 times by Hewitt that virtually NO NEW FENCE has been completed, with all the reasons why.

Are you guys SURE we really went to the moon in ten years, or was that some kind of ICE Hoax film?
Warhol could never have concocted a "POTUS" as bizzare as one that would be sending out agents that could not talk straight about why there has been no real improvement in security on the border 5 years after 9-11.

Doug said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Doug said...

One might ask if it is really a good idea for Business, as well as Federal and Local Govts to be formulating policy in consultation with Anti-American groups like MECHA and La Raza.

Unless one thinks Reconquista is a good thing.
"General membership shall consist of any student who accepts, believes and works for the goals and objectives of MEChA, including the liberation of AZTLAN, meaning self-determination of our people in this occupied state and the physical liberation of our land."
Doing a Job American Citizens tend not do.

Doug said...

A Border Agent Trainer tells Hugh they cannot get intelligent, fit applicants, because intelligent people know they get no respect and work under impossible ROE's.

Says they are hiring fat dumb folks and lowering training standards, so upshot will be four new people on the payroll, and 1 type A employee doing the same job he's always done.
...until Johnny Sutton puts him in prison.