The black sheep of the family

Monday, October 03, 2005
The title of my post refers to us Democrats who voted for George Bush.

You know who I mean.

People like Zell Miller.

Ed Koch.

Harriet Miers.

Those of us who were known to vote for or give support to the enemy.

By the enemy I am not talking about AlQaida, I am talking about the Democrats.

When Republicans need to win a majority, we come in handy.

But give us an important job? Like the Supreme Court? nahhh.

Much better to pick a conservative idealogue so that there will be no question how he/she/it will vote on any issue that might come along.

Much better that the rest of the country continue to watch this partisan bar fight that is fast turning American politics into something anarchists everywhere would admire. Mayhem.

People are sick of the bickering and where we are at it again.

I give up. I am sick of the silly indictments and the media circus and the whining about everything all the time from everyone everywhere.

And without me and people like me the zealots are lost.

If the moderates, the folks who long for happy endings, the folks who just want things to turn out half way decent give up and walk away then where will be the hand wringers be?

Where will the not one more dime club be?


Keep that in mind.

44 comments:

Knucklehead said...

Terrye,

You're not allowed to quit on us. There's precious few moderates and y'all have to counterbalance loons like me.

MeaninglessHotAir said...

I liked this comment from Michelle Malkin's blog. An outraged caller said "[Bush] advocates conservatism to placate the base and then he acts like a moderate because he is a moderate."

Right. He's a moderate. He's been villified by the anti-Americans for a long time because he goes to church (EVIL!) and believes in free enterprise, and that constant vituperation tends to deafen us to the reality. He's a moderate. Like Clinton.

Plus I think all these bloggers like Glenn Reynolds are frustrated because they think they're a lot more important than they are.

vnjagvet said...

Terrye and the gang.

Glen's just acting like a law professor. People who practice law for a living are somehow not smart enough unless they have the right credentials like law review and/or Supreme Court clerkships.

Let's just see how she performs in the hearings. If she comes across as a normal, decent human being, she will be confirmed. If that happens, she will be a pretty good justice. Mark my words.

PS, even Scalia and Thomas are simply wrong sometimes. I know that is hard to believe, but 'tis true.

Hugh Hewitt is a voice of reason today among the blogorati (a make up) of the right.

I would like to think I am, too.

chuck said...

Hugh Hewitt is a voice of reason today among the blogorati (a make up) of the right.

As he was during Katrina. I think Hugh tends to be overoptimistic, but that can be a refreshing and sane attitude these days. Anyway, reserve judgement is my personal prescription.

terrye said...

I just called a troll on polipundit because I dared to assume that perhaps Bush knew what he was doing.

Sometimes people on the right are just as nuts as people on the left.

Why not give her a chance? It is as if they had their hearts set on some big fight.

Well I have news for them, they are losing people with this nonstop confrontational attitude. Both sides are driving the middle away.

terrye said...

I meant to say I just got called a troll....

Knucklehead said...

Why not give her a chance? It is as if they had their hearts set on some big fight.

Once again you exercise your gift.

I think you've got it pegged. It's as if they want to unBork Bork or live though another Borking to prove we won't lose this time.

As Beldar pointed out, Bork has cast precisely zero SCOTUS votes.

A gigantic fight would serve no purpose. A frothing anti-abortion (or whichever issue) nominee would not get through the process. Why go through the battle just for the heck of it and accomplish nothing but the blood-letting?

The moonbats are going to jump around screeching like flying monkeys anyway - allow them to make fools of themselves and they don't need us schrieking back at them to do so.

Put some sensible, decent, non-moonbats on the court and it will be improved and the country will be well served.

flenser said...

I don't want a sensible decent person on the court, per se.

I want a good justice on the court. That person may be good and decent and sensible, I hope, but it does not matter. Any more than it matters that my plumber or electrician is a decent person.

I want them to be professional and good at their job. Thats all. Whether Miers will fit that bill is a mystery.

terrye said...

flenser:

I think there are two points here:

Whether anyone would fit that bill is a mystery until they fit it.

And it is Bush's job to pick them. It is not fair or productive to put him in the position where he has to worry about people going nuts for no good reason just because they think maybe this might not be the right person.

So far he has not put an unqualified judge on the bench, I have no reason to believe he will start now.

Jamie Irons said...

Terrye,

I really, REALLY like what you have said here.

From long experience reading your posts I (think I) know you to be a very sane, no-nonsense person, who is in a non-academic way a brilliant thinker.

What you said about both sides driving the middle away is eactly right.

Since 9/11 my affection for people on the right has gone up by orders of magnitude, but they can, just like those on the left, be nauseatingly self-righteous on occasion.

[Less seriously, I think you should "call a troll" every now and then. We all should.

Those people get lonely.

That's why they hang around blogs pestering more normal people.)

;-)


Jamie Irons

terrye said...

Jamie:

Here troll, nice troll, come to mama.

Thank you for your kind words.

I really am getting tired of watching grown people on either end of the political spectrum behaving like children playing king of the hill.

After awhile someone gets hurt and the game ceases to be fun.

I was talking to friend of mine today who said he had quit watching the news.

The nonstop bickering made him hate politics he said.

The last thing we need is more apathy.

I guess Reid got in trouble with some Democratic staffers for saying something nice about Miers.

Pretty damn sad when a country at war can not have two opposing leaders same something kind about the same person.

terrye said...

say = same and I give up.

Rick Ballard said...

Don't give up - you're cheering me up.

Besides, you said real women don't use Priveew.

terrye said...

rick:

And God knows I am a real woman.

A real menopausal woman that is.

You should have seen me looking for my car keys today. I had them in my hand the whole time.

And to think I used to play volley ball without a bra. If I did that today I would beat myself to death.

chuck said...

Terrye,

So far he has not put an unqualified judge on the bench, I have no reason to believe he will start now.

Indeed, he has made some excellent picks, IMHO. And I suspect Miers was involved in those picks. Much will depend on how Miers handles herself before the Committee on the Judiciary . If she is articulate and in control I think folks will feel much assured. If not...

terrye said...

Chuck:

I just wish people would get a grip.

Rick Ballard said...

Well, it's sad to have to repack the flamethrower but as I've read through some of the interviews with people who know her I'm beginning to see her as a solid fourth with Scalia, Thomas and Roberts. To do as well as she has done as a litigator and to have served in the jobs she had in Texas makes it unlikely that she will turn out to be a Souter type.

I was actually looking forward to having the Seven Dwarves on the hot seat but I can wait for that.

I'll just work on my conservative catechism for future use in the public schools.

Rick Ballard said...

Btw - she's catnip for the social conservatives. Watch the dawning horror on the left as that sinks in.

terrye said...

rick:

Well go tell that to some conservatives. The posters as sites like polipundit are outraged, outraged I tell you.

Their first reaction is attack.

That is what bothered me.

I may end up not liking the woman but to immediately go nuts strikes me as a little premature.

flenser said...

terrye

"Whether anyone would fit that bill is a mystery until they fit it."

Thats not completely true. There will always be some element of the unknown, but if a judge has a track record than you can get a pretty good idea.

Yes, it is Bush's job to pick them. And it is our job to judge the quality of the work our elected officials are doing. I'm not sure why that is such a controversial stance. This pick, in the judgement of a great many people from across the spectrum, was a poor one. Are they all supposed to just shut and pretend otherwise?

Thay cannot all be "ideologues", surely. What is an ideologue anyway? It basically seems to be a word meaning "somebody who has ideas different than mine".

MeaninglessHotAir said...

flenser,

I, personally, would welcome any Bush nominees you might care to mention who would be approved by the "left" side of the political "spectrum".

Rick Ballard said...

Terrye,

They'll wake up when the left starts to howl. They need to reflect on the importance of the socially conservative base rather than being outraged at a theoretical breach of some unwritten conservative purity code.

chuck said...

Thay cannot all be "ideologues", surely.

True, but there is a certain note of hysteria that I've gotten sick and tired of. Really, why do all the grownups have to throw tantrums when they don't get the toy they were expecting. They haven't even played with the new toy yet.

Sure, I might wish for Luttig, McConnell, or JRB. But it doesn't follow that Miers is worthless. Let's wait to pass judgement.

chuck said...

They'll wake up when the left starts to howl.

I still think religion will be the big issue here. Will Miers be tarred as an evangelical? I'm betting on it. Could be veeery interesting.

terrye said...

Flenser:

If I had a dollar for everytime the right or left ranted because they were betrayed I could quit my job.

Performance can not be seen in advance. The Supreme Court Justices has proven that time and again.

Judgment should be the criteria.

If I remember correctly Kennedy had some pretty good convservative credentials and now they bitch about him too.

It is as if the right believes that Bush was obligated to pick one of the special people they had settled on and to hell with everyone else.

Across the spectrum?

Believe it or not the pundits are not as important as they think they are.

The spectrum jumped on this like vultures on road kill and there may come a time in the future when they regret it.

Most people do not want a strong right winger in there. They want a fair person with good judgment.

Rick Ballard said...

"Will Miers be tarred as an evangelical?"

Well here is the statement of faith for her home church. Kind of tough for her to hide it.

terrye said...

Rick:

Holy rollers.

Gee, but she is prolife?

Rick Ballard said...

Terrye,

Hardly holy rollers. That's what is known as a 'Baptist Light' SoF, which means that it is non-Calvinist in nature - as well as non-Pentecostal. Her church does not focus on social matters at all. There is no need to discuss either abortion or homosexuality - both are settled matters.

Her pastor has a radio show that draws a weekly audience of five million. You won't find any public statements from him concerning social matters either - again - no need.

These types of evangelical churches are completely separate from the Falwell-Robertson types and generally have notheing to do with them. They are apolitical by design and strongly focused solely on true evangelism.

If the windbag Senators try and go after her on this they're going to find out what a real 'third rail' feels like when you touch it.

flenser said...

MHA

Reid approved of Miers. I consider Reid from the left end of the spectrum. Depending on your own POV, you may or may not agree. What is your POV, by the way?

chuck

I still trying to find out more about Miers. But regardless of what kind of judge she turns out to be, this was a big political blunder by the WH. I don't see how anyone in their right mind can say otherwise. It lets the Dem's completely off the hook, and puts the conservative Republican senators on it.



terrye

I have no idea what you mean by a strong right winger. Miers may well be one of those. I'd still think she was a bad pick though.


When you say that most people want a judge with good judgement, you are rather begging the question. Eveyone in the world wants a judge with good judgement. The question is, how is that defined.

chuck said...

Gee, but she is prolife?

One of my uncles, a long time missionary and evangelical living in OK, is still a staunch Democrat. As he said, some folks accuse his church of "socialism" because of their views on sharing and charity. Indeed, I wonder if the old Democratic programs didn't derive much support from such people. But these days the Democrats seem determined to drive away believers. I think it will be interesting to watch the opposition. Heck, what if Muslim groups weigh in, CAIR for instance? Really, this could split the Democrats even more than the Republicans. Can a believer sit on the Court? We will find out.

terrye said...

chuck:

I know old Democrats like that.

I think it could split them, I know that a lot of Democratic staffers were unhappy with Reid saying something nice about her.

So were some Republicans.

terrye said...

flenser:

Leahy said nice things about Roberts too and somehow Republicans did not get the vapors.

This woman has been a real practicing attorney for many years. She knows the court and she has shown good enough judgment to make a very good name for herself both in conservative legal circles as well as among people who do not share her political views.

Read Beldar.

Republicans were spoiling for a fight and that is not something the rest of the country wants right now.

I find this knee jerk hysterical response from people who are going after this woman to be absurd.

It makes me wonder if Republicans are really prepared to be a majority party. Maybe they would do better representing some small extreme intolerant slither of society that really does not care what the rest of us think.

I am not saying Miers is the best pick, but she is Bush's pick and that is his job. Not mine or yours.

Now it is the Senate's turn to do their job.

chuck said...

Some further thoughts on religion. Roosevelt put together a party that combined the athiest left with the old populist, religious South. That is now coming apart, has come apart. The question now is whether the Repulicans can manage to shelter these folks together with the athiest conservatives whose main concerns are small government and strict Constitutional interpretation. Many, or even most, of the evangelical types don't hold with such as Robertson.

MeaninglessHotAir said...

flenser,

What is your POV, by the way?

It depends. What's the issue?

terrye said...

chuck:

The faith based initiatives have helped to draw in some religious people but there are still many people of faith that are suspicious of Republicans and the money they think they represent.

And for years many religious people championed the poor and feel an obligation to them.


I take care of sick people and I have nver met a fiscal conservative getting medicare who wanted to give it back.

So when I hear fiscal conservatives talk about spending, sometimes I wonder if they even know how many people in their own families may be dependent on the government or a church.

Healthy prosperous people don't always think about these things.

flenser said...

MHA

Politics?

flenser said...

chuck

I'm one of those atheist conservatives whose main concerns are small government and strict Constitutional interpretation. And I have great respect for the religious conservatives, who have a lot of the same goals as I do. So I'm sure the GOP can accomodate us in the same party. I can't think of a topic I disagree with them on. Maybe the death penalty.

David Thomson said...

I've now had over twelve hours to think about Harriet Miers. My hunch is that she is a solid conservative jurist. The only remaining question I have is whether she’s also a leader. Miers apparently knows a lot about business law. This should prove invaluable in the upcoming years. Is she an A candidate? Maybe. Nonetheless, I’m relatively sure Meirs minimally rates a B.

There’s too much hysterical talk regarding President Bush’s alleged declining popularity with the hard core right wingers. The elections of 2006 will not take place for another thirteen months! These people will change their mind if Miers proves to be a good choice.

terrye said...

david:

Well right now the right is in declining popularity with me.

It is as if the other people who share the US with them are of no matter. It is their way or the highway.

no discussion... no debate.

I am getting sick of the Bill Kristols etc. Hell Bill even wants to get rid of Rumsfeld.

David Thomson said...

“Well right now the right is in declining popularity with me.”

Fair enough. You need to join the Republican Party. The real arguments are only taking place within the GOP. There is nothing of value going on in the Democratic ranks. This political organization is dead. The mad hatters have taken over---and it is virtually impossible to remove them.

chuck said...

I am getting sick of the Bill Kristols etc. Hell Bill even wants to get rid of Rumsfeld.

Life as a pundit is debilitating and disorienting. Too little responsibility, I suppose. Orwell used to say the same of the Leftist intellectuals, but I suspect it is generic. Like River in Serenity, you never know when they will go nuts or whom they will attack.

Knucklehead said...

Flenser,

This pick, in the judgement of a great many people from across the spectrum, was a poor one.

That is reasonably clear. Some of us seen to believe it was a "leap of logic" that we cannot follow.

What I suspect we are seeing happening here is the "litmus test" of the right. They have a short list of judicial issues they believe important (a very good thing to have) and short list of potential nominees they believe are vetted against that list (also a reasonably good thing to have but potentially too confining).

The problem, as far as I can figure it out, is that the right is pissed that she isn't a pre-vetted nominee rather than wondering if she would pass muster when they know more about her.

The left has been using theirs for years and now the right wants to play "turnabout". They're spoiling for the fight they feel should have been joined ages ago against Dem appointments and some of Reagan and Bush 1 appointments.

While this desire to play "turnabout" is somewhat understandable it is not good for the nation's political process. It is the sort of thing some portion of the BDS left is playing - "getting even" for the way St. Bubba was treated.

I'd prefer that the adults not fall into the turnabout trap.

Are they all supposed to just shut and pretend otherwise?

Miers was not on the short list of already vetted nominees. Have the huff and get over it. Now its time to try and determine if she is a nominee who can reasonably be expected to rule well and fairly on those topics on the short list. If she were better known would she be successfully vetted against the list? We'll soon see insofar as it is possible.

Knucklehead said...

Beldar, here and here, responds to some of the negative commentary, and Jim Miller has a different, but supportive, take on the Mier nomination.

chuck said...

I also like some of Althouse's comments. She hasn't come out with an opinion, but she says some of Miers' early experiences becoming a lawyer resonate with her. The attitude towards professional woman back in the 50's and 60's was much different than today. I think it would be wrong to underestimate the impact such attitudes had on Miers' acquisition of old boy credentials.